Sometimes you’ve just got to put your hands up and say “well played India, we were rubbish”. For that, my pedigree chums, was the truth in Mohali. India have been too good for us. Full stop.
We always thought this would be a tough tour, and that we’d need to play at our very best to be competitive, but unfortunately we’ve played well below our potential. This has enabled our hosts to swing their collective boot and catch us square in the nuts. And yes, it stings a little.
I’m particularly disappointed because Mohali was supposed to be our best chance, or at least one of the best, to win a test on this tour. It’s a little cooler in the north of India – albeit not quite Durham in May – and the pitch didn’t offer the extravagant turn that English batsmen fear so much. We should have been a lot more competitive but simply didn’t put it all together.
England are now officially in a rut. We’ve lost 4 of our last 6 tests (winning just once) and the team simply isn’t improving. I’m sorry but it’s not. Yes there are bright spots – Hameed and Rashid look like they might have bright futures – but the batting is still a huge problem.
And let’s not pretend that these poor performances are just down to unfamiliar conditions. Don’t forget that we lost twice to Pakistan at home last summer and (as we’ve just seen) the Pakistanis really aren’t that good. They lost nine wickets in a session overnight against New Zealand and went down by 138 runs. That’s Dhaka dreadful.
No doubt some people are blaming the schedule for England’s woes – even Alastair Cook used exhaustion as an excuse after the game – but I’m not so sure it’s that simple. Although fatigue always seems tougher for touring teams, India have also played a lot of test cricket recently. They whitewashed New Zealand just before England arrived.
Yes the ridiculous schedule hasn’t helped – and nobody should forgive the ECB for yet more administrative incompetence – but there’s a far simpler explanation for England’s recent travails: India are just better than us.
If one compares the two teams, man of man, India are stronger. This isn’t a stereotypical Indian team. For many years India possessed skilful batsmen – who can forget artists like Tendulkar, Dravid and Laxman? – but the was no devil about them. They were, in effect, just a little too nice. Plus they couldn’t field for toffee. Sehwag used to provide a barrel of laughs as he trotted around the outfield with all the grace and athleticism of a hippo.
However, times have changed. India still have the skilful batsmen – and they probably always will – but their fielding has improved quite a lot and their traditional ‘battery’ of dibbly-dobbly medium pacers has been replaced by fast bowlers with good pace and a little nastiness. If you don’t believe me just ask Chris Woakes’ helmet.
Plus, of course, the whole mind-set of the Indian team seems to have changed. Virat Kohli is passionate, aggressive, and a little bit arrogant (in a good way). He’s almost Australian in the way he leads his side. It’s given India a hard edge and it’s no surprise they’re top of the world rankings as a result. They aren’t the complete package yet, but from what I’ve seen I think they deserve their number one tag.
It’s hard to know where England go from here. The players will have a few days off (although it’s only a few) and then they’ll return to the coalface again – knowing only too well that at 0-4 defeat is probable …
The one batting bright spot of the tour, the admirable Haseeb Hameed, is returning to England with a broken hand. And three of the players on tour (Duckett, Ballance and Batty) look mentally broken.
Whoever replaces Hameed – and we believe that will either be Nick Gubbins or Keaton Jennings – will need to play bloody well at very short notice. The last thing we needed was one of our star turns getting hurt. Unfortunately that’s just the kind of thing that happens when tours unravel.
We all have to hope that England can dig deep and somehow pull out a performance at Mumbai. They can start by winning the toss and actually batting well for a change.
James Morgan
The only excuse for England is if they’re stressed over Brexit and Trump (like me). Otherwise no excuses.
England need to go back to the drawing board. Look at the batting lineup cos it’s not working. And settle on the spinner role.
Never fear. I believe the Lord Strauss is being lined up to replace La May when Brexit goes wrong. This has two benefits. The incidental one is that Strauss may sort out Brexit. The major benefit is that he may be replaced in his cricket role with someone who will deal with the selector problem. The depth of this problem is shown by the stupidity (confirmed by James) that they are thinking of replacing Hameed with a test newbie with one decent season when they need experience, especially in India.
It also seems time for Cook to step back to concentrate on his opening role (after this tour). I admire Cook as a bat, and he can only benefit from focusing on that role. However, his performance as a captain on this tour has been woeful. Duckett has been mismanaged by being played out of position in Bangladesh. It was idiotic to send in Stokes 30 minutes before the close on day 3 and why was Woakes asked to bowl to Ashwin without a gully or third man when everyone knows that is where he likes to score? There are plenty of other examples.
Let’s give genuine thanks to Cook for his efforts as captain and hope for another 3-4 years as opener. The only problem is who can become skipper given Root’s lack of experience in the role and the need for him to lead the batting effort.
Bayliss said they would be looking for a top order batsman. That suggests to me that Root will open. When it comes to the choice I think we have to rule out another heft hander, cancelling out both Gubbins and Jennings. Bell or Billings seem to be the Sky team favourites, but we shall see. I’m happy with Root opening. With his experience he should fare better than any of the youngsters at presently with the Lions.
Injuries can’t be helped but it’s a pretty pickle that we have got ourselves into. What a baptism of fire for poor Hameed and how brilliantly he has stood up to it. Here’s hoping that a plate in his hand will not impact on his future batting performance. Given the way he played almost one handed today, character and skill will be on his side.
Are they going to pin his hand? I am surprised as I thought it was just his little finger. I smashed and dislocated the same finger 45 years ago (not batting!) and have had no trouble with it since then. I sometimes think the docs are a bit too eager to pin finger bones these days.
Apparently it’s a bad break – the bone snapped like a dry twig – rather than a simple fracture.
The reason he came in so low down was that he needed the net sessions to work out how modify his technique to bat with it.
Impressive lad.
Nasser Hussain said on Sky during commentary that the replacement would come from the Lions – a top order player meaning an opener. He mentioned both Gubbins and Jennings. Perhaps things have changed since then? I’ve not seen The Verdict yet.
I’m often accused of being a bit of a cheerleader but even I can’t make a silk purse out of this one.
As you said James this was our best chance.
So 1st of all we needed to pick a team that scored 400 and took 20 wickets… Call for Gareth Batty then.
The 1st day batting display should haunt this team for a long time. I’m not even letting Bairstow off the hook as he should have converted his opportunity.
We then got back into the game only to let Ashwin & Jadeja take it away from us.
I think we missed Broad who may have got the vital wicket but that’s only a may.
Going forward. I wouldn’t select an uncapped player, these could be two very hard tests and I’d protect a new bloke from them.
Batty , Ballance & Ansari should be on the plane home with Hameed.
I’d call up Hales (give him a chance at 4) or swallow some pride and send for Bell.
Also the nature of this defeat has the feeling of the end of an era….
There’s a curious little nugget tucked away in the report of Paul Newman in today’s DM:
“The England captain, who is given the final word on selection”.
Newman has been a fierce advocate of Cook. He is referring to the starting XI – whether this applies to the tour squad as a whole isn’t so clear. It’s also fair to say that captains have always had more power on tour than at home.
However I hope this will be remembered next time “the selectors” are in the firing line. I’m not defending them by any means and have been arguing for two years here that the system with its manifest conflicts of interest is a flawed one. I wouldn’t lose a wink of sleep if James Whitaker was fired or resigned. But there has been a whiff of responsibility without power about the selectors since Strauss threatened to abolish them and then didn’t.
It would be interesting to know how many previous captains had this power. I’m also not too sure this reflects well on Bayliss.
I didn’t see that.
Given his general cluelessness regarding spinners, it’s remarkable – and removes any vestige of an excuse for his handling of them in the field.
I’m surprised not to have seen the phrase “difficult winter” used with reference to the current tribulations, but then I suppose we are only in November and “difficult autumn” doesn’t quite have the same ring. Still, I wonder who the scapegoat(s) will be this time around if Team ECB do end up going home with a 4-0 series loss to India and 1-1 draw against Bangladesh?
So everyone has finally realised the blindingly obvious that Englands current batters are not actually that good. However, most of your answers are to send for more who simply have similar techniques and mentalities !!! Are you not bloody learning .
Hameed, quite simply shows the way forward is to have a technique and mentality to bat time and not be all biff biff.. and yet, not one of you is saying about finding more players with that technique or mentality.
Jesus.. hales really!!?!?!? Duckett has shown he is simply rubbish.. now he needs to go away and decide if he wants to be a test player or simply a white ball player because he sure as hell won’t make it if he stays like he is.
Ffs people learn from things, don’t just replace one white ball player with another.
Ali keeps making people’s top six.. why!!! Why why why .. he has proven beyond doubt that he isn’t upto it.. if we must play him, 8 it is.
Cook
Hameed
Jennings
Root
Gubbins
Bairstow
Stokes
Woakes
Ali/Rashid
Whoever else is left
As an Indian fan, I am rather pleased with our performance. The batting clicked (save for Rahane and Vijay), all of our bowlers are doing well (heck I don’t think I’ve ever seen our pacemen outbowling their english counterparts prior to this) and Ashwin deserves his status as the world’s no.1 allrounder right now.
England, on the other hand, have problems. Their batting has been crap so far, Cook can’t seem to pick Ashwin at all, Root seems to have frequent brain fades, and they don’t have a no.4. Ali should be batting no higher than 5, and I have no idea what Ballance, Finn & Duckett are still doing in India. They are basically unselectable, so wouldn’t it be a better idea for them to join the lions tour? Cook is also a very poor captain, with inexplicable field placings and bowling changes. He is also too defensive, and England would probably be better off with a more aggressive captain in charge.
I also have questions about the English management. How have they picked Ballance as cover for Duckett, when he clearly has technical problems himself? Why did they not send for any other players? Does Bayliss actually watch any county cricket? He doesn’t seem to know any of the new players, so how exactly is he picking them?
Hi Paul,
Thanks for joining us at TFT. I tend to agree with everything you say. India have impressed me and I think their future is bright. Having good seam bowlers will enable India to compete all around the world – something they haven’t always been able to do.
You’re spot on in your analysis of England’s batting problems and Cook’s captaincy. He tries manfully but he’s not a natural tactician. Re: Bayliss, he’s not actually a selector. He never gets the chance to watch any county cricket. He (and the captain) basically pick the final XI from the squad of 16 the selectors given them. In that sense, his hands are tied a little and he has to make do with the players he’s got.
It just seems a little odd that the coach has basically no idea who the new players are, atleast he have a couple of scouts watching the matches. I’ve also read that Cook has the final say on selection, so if that is teh case, why did he he pick batty in Mohali and then proceed to not use him? I’m not expecting miracles from Batty, but the lack of confidence Cook has in his spinners (barring Rashid, and that only recently) is something I don’t agree with. If you don’t trust your spinners, why play 3 of them?
Ali has also curiously escaped criticism, he hasn’t batted or bowled particularly well over the last couple of matches. I’m not sure if he is there as a bowler or a batsmen, because he’s not doing either of the roles currently.
I think Batty was picked only because Ansari is injured, but I agree – he added nothing to the team.
In any event, Cook admits he and/or Bayliss misread the pitch (cricinfo):
Cook also admitted England may have erred in their selection for Mohali. The presence of a third spinner – and a second off-spinner, in particular – was superfluous, with Cook suggesting the option of a fourth seamer would have been more beneficial.
“All of us probably misread the pitch,” Cook said. “we thought it was dry and would spin more. If we had known what we do now, we would have gone four seamers two spinners. The seamers were always in the game with reverse and the way we bash length, we can control the scoring rate very well.”
Cook’s captaincy is plain weird – he’s gone from underbowling Rashid to over bowling him, and the reverse for Moeen.
His treatment of Batty seemed designed to undermine any confidence he might have.
I saw 3 separate “expert” video assessments of the Mohali pitch before the match and each one said it was going to be similar to Vizag. Turned out it was actually almost the perfect Test wicket. I think India did fantastically to win the match – to lose the toss then turn it around from 80 behind with 6 wickets down to register a comprehensive victory was a truly outstanding effort, however poor England might have been.
Personally, my take on the batting is that the problem is the openers, and as Cook is the “constant” then he must be the problem.
His captaincy is also questionable – he almost always uses up one review if he is given out other than bowled, and he succumbs to the demands of his “mates” when it comes to wasting bowling reviews.
I don’t really think the system – ( ie get 400 and you shouldn’t lose), but the players seem incapable of playing it. Maybe we need to “stabilise” by getting Morgan is as captain for a couple of series – in much the same way as Brearley was employed in the past.
I don’t think the problem is the coaches, but too many people seem to get dumped after a couple of games, whereas the “chosen ones of the right stock” get chance after chance after…
These last two tests in the field, Cook has long spells looking as if he has no idea what to do/try – so that is one area the selectors can influence directly.
Sorry, I meant:
I don’t really think the system is flawed – ( ie get 400 and you shouldn’t lose)
England tried to play this tour with too many learning on the job (as someone once said, “you win nothing with kids”). I agree India are a very good side in home conditions (I think we’d beat them in England). Some have stood up to it (Hameed, Rashid), some (Duckett, Ansari) haven’t. As everyone has said, England threw this test away on the first morning, so the batting is the more immediate problem. Unfortunately, the obvious “experienced” solution (Ian Bell) is the last person I’d look to (with any talent!) to shore up a flaky batting line up. We don’t need another pretty 30 and out 10 minutes before lunch off a stupid shot.
The bowling is a more mixed bag. Broad, Rashid and (especially) Stokes have been excellent, but there’s not much apart from that. If the choice is Batty or Ansari, I’d go for Ansari, on potential. Whether that should be the choice is a matter for debate.
I have to say, in fairness, that India have played very well. Kohli and Pujara are two fine batsmen (as is Rahane, who is out of form). The spinners are unrelentingly accurate (Jadeja reminds me a bit of Paul Collingwood: not the most naturally talented member of the side, but makes the absolute most of his abilities), and the fast bowlers are quick and hostile. I think we must factor this into any assessment of England’s performance.
The only consolation for England is that both South Africa and Australia got hammered in India, and possibly played worse than England.
There was a big difference between Hameed/Rashid and Duckett/Ansari. Hameed, although young, is a genuine red ball player (with a strike rate of 38) and Rashid is no longer a kid. Duckett is a banger and Ansari has never really recovered form from past injuries. Hameed showed the need for technique in batting in tests in India, which would point to Bell or Billings (whose reputation as a banger masks a correct technique – unlike most bangers).
Essentially I agree with you (though Rashid is still very much learning test cricket), apart from Bell. Technique or not, he has that annoying talent for getting out at precisely the wrong moment. Surely we have plenty of that already.
Look, if he came back for a couple of years and only managed to average 35 (his career average is about 42) he would STILL be a much better pick than Duckett, Hales, Vince or latter day Ballance have proven to be. We have a middle order lacking in long term experience and in a constant state of flux and reinvention. Bringing in a senior player at 4 or 5 could go some way towards anchoring it.
118 tests, 22 centuries, 46 fifties, 7,727 runs. He’s certainly not the panacea for all of England’s ills, and granted he’s no Sangakkara, but that’s not too shabby a record either.
Totally agree Oreston. The disappointment/ frustration people have with Bell stems from the high expectations everyone has for him (because he looks so good and has so much talent). If he had, say, Paul Collingwood ability, and was averaging 35, everyone would probably think ‘yeah he’s still contributing and worth his place as a decent test player’. The other thing about Bell is that he’s right handed. That would certainly help the middle order too.
I think they’ve idetified Ansari as a FEC because he’s “from the right sort of family” and as a result he’s getting opportunities that haven’t necessarily been deserved.
I think it is more a case of ‘Surrey uber alles’ as there can be no other explanation for the selection in recent years (for various England teams) of Meaker, Dernbach, Batty and Tremlett (his return to tests after moving to Surrey). Oddly, the one who deserved more (but was repeatedly overlooked) was Martin Bicknell. There is also the issue of Steven Davies, the best keeper in England for a long time – but that is a case where the attitude of the cricket establishment becomes a bit murky.
That assumption about his background seems more than a little unfair. From what I read, he is just an intelligent lad from an intelligent family. Not his fault that his parents are professors or that he graduated from a top uni… you still have to work for that kind of thing!
That being said, I will agree that he’s not pulled up any trees on the playing front. This management do love their all-round cricketers (like the just-picked Dawson), but how both of these blokes are getting selected above Jack Leach is a joke. Being better at catching and batting is not a good enough reason, Leach is actually a specialist!
It’s just my opinion and it may of course be wrong. That said, I don’t think the culture at the ECB has shifted a great deal in the 30 years since Chris Cowdrey was randomly plucked as England captain in spite of being nowhere near good enough to even be in the side, just because “Uncle Peter” happened to be chairman of selectors. For recent evidence, look at how the Director of Cricket job description was written to fit Andrew Strauss’s profile, as opposed to on an objective set of requirements based on actual needs. It’s still a “face fits, don’t rock the boat” culture.
SA lost every toss, had both their opening bowlers injured and lost the first two Tests by margins of less than 150 runs. They then held out for 143 overs in the last Test. Australia played the third Test of the ill-fated “Homeworkgate” tour in Mohali. They scored 400 in their first innings and lost by six wickets.
England lost by nearly 250 runs (or held out for 98 overs if you prefer) and 8 wickets. So no, England are not doing better than those two teams.
I see Keaton Jennings and Liam Dawson are joining the squad. So England still not looking for a specialist left arm spinner.
Why oh why do we keep picking spinners based on their batting ability? Sigh.
Why ?
Apparently, the hand of Flower…
http://www.espncricinfo.com/india-v-england-2016-17/content/story/1069942.html
Loved that comment ‘(he will be) low-maintenance on and off the pitch’
Well yes, explains so much.
Just seen that it is Jennings for Hameed. Good luck to him but I cannot see the logic in dumping a novice into two must win tests. Bell, Hales or Billings would have made more sense. There will be those who say Hameed is a novice – but he has been a success from day one of his FC career whilst Jennings only came good in 2016 and was previously badly exposed in the Championship.
This selection says more about the selectors than it does about the right answer to England’s needs.
Leach took 65 wickets last year at 21.9, Dawson took 20 at 43.8.
Blame “the selectors”? Who is known to not regard CC performances? Who gave an rare interview praising Dawson to the heavens on 10/3/2016? (I won’t post a direct link as WordPress sometimes eats posts with links – but look it up at the Guardian).
Hi Simon,
One or two links is usually fine. I made a choice in the site settings to ‘spam’ anything with multiple links. Spam is actually quite a big problem for me – especially as TFT has a good domain authority and has been around for 8 years. Lots of spammers are desperate to get links attached to our domain (to help their search engine optimisation) and one way they do this is to put links in the comments. Sorry if this is a pain – but it’s an even bigger pain for me to go through the comments every night and delete all the spammers. Hope you understand mate.
Cheers,
James
Just back to the selectors, I wonder how much Fraser’s Middlesex links led to Jennings’ selection? Gus is a sensitive soul and perhaps he didn’t want to be accused of bias by picking Middlesex’s Gubbins (who has a better first class average)?
This is why having selectors who are full time employees of particular counties doesn’t work. It just makes things very complicated. Fraser is effectively damned if he does and damned if he doesn’t pick Middlesex players.
Batsmen who can’t play spin selected to tour India (who have the world’s best spin bowler) and England’s best spinner left at home – let’s think that one through.
Yes indeed. Makes me wonder what kind of inept management we have in England Cricket.
Hi all,
Interesting reading all your comments. Does this fiasco mean that chickens have come home to roost at last? The second era of cricket with new leaders seems to have gone as well as the first new era of cricket. King Cook still there I see as is Lord Strauss and even dear old coach couldn’t remedy this team. It most certainly is a “new era” of errr umm errr um. failure. It could be worse of course. We could be Australia and they’re not having much of good time at the moment.
A lot of folk on here hoped that a new Chairman & coach might dig this team out of the mire but alas and alack. The cynics on here, including me, said it would end in tears.
There is hope of course. There are players in the England team who have shown such skill, but where has that skill gone. How is it that our test cricket team just cannot perform well enough to win? Now some of these players are also in the one day team and play damn well. Now please don’t throw that old chestnut that one day is different from Test Cricket. There has to be good reasons why the Test Team lack the killer instinct. I’ll leave that one there.
Management, leaders’ are not the right people. Cook has to go and the management must see that now. Will they act? I doubt it. I expect they will want Cook to fall on his own sword. Their collective inability to see the writing on the wall way back showed how sordid their “management” skills lacked real nous. So chickens & roost? Yeah I think so.
Jennings at least has a good recent record, though I’m surprised they went for a left-hander.
Dawson’s selection is just baffling. He’s played 117 first class matches and taken 130 wickets, with just three 5-fors! That’s dreadful. The Indians will have been playing spinners of higher quality since their school days.
England like to pick on character as much as talent. Hence the decision to leave out Jack Leach. However, what we haven’t quite figured out yet is that character is no bloody good without talent.
Yes indeed – as per my comment above re Ansari. Other selection criteria include non-spinning spinners and batsmen “who are really good apart from that they keep getting out”.
It would also help if they were decent judges of character….
I saw Jack Leach on practice day – 2 days before the Edgbaston Test v Pakistan – bowling to the England batsmen in the nets. I think Peter Such is still the spin bowling guru within the England camp. Leach had to be upper most in the minds of management otherwise he wouldn’t have been invited to bowl in the nets. Perhaps, they feel his championship wickets came on helpful tracks which is ironic because you should expect more spin assistance from Indian tracks.
This may sound convoluted but there is a certain skill in bowling on helpful, turning tracks esp if it’s a square turner. Over spinning the ball will not find the edges.
Leach also took 6-64 against Yorkshire at Headingley so if they think he only did well at Taunton they’re mistaken.
Maybe it’s too close to Big Bash to pull Sam Billings out of his commitments there?
I doubt it. Bell is also in the Big Bash and the local rag in Birmingham had a story about him being available if needed.
I still don’t get the dropping of Bell nearly 12 months on.
At the time I thought ok, maybe he needs a tour off after 10 years of constant international cricket..
But his replacements are no longer playing (Compton & Taylor obviously for different reasons)
I understood the selection of Vince for the home summer, on paper it was a friendly summer and he was highly rated, so fair to give him a go. He failed.
How far are we going to drill down before someone finally admits they got rid of the most talented player of his generation far too early?
I hope the Big Bash re-invigorates him and that he comes back and scores a boatload early next summer. It is not too late to backtrack.
Wow! Another promising young left hander being brought in to Ashwin’s abbatoir. On pitches that will most likely help him more than the ones we’ve had so far. Will England never learn? As for Dawson, wow. Just wow.
I’d personally give Ballance the last two games. He has not played a single match in India yet. The series is gone but if he plays well than this could be the making of him. And if he doesn’t, well, there’s probably not that much confidence left in him to get shot. He will go back to county cricket with some introspection in hand. He is hopefully itching to prove the whole goddamned world wrong.
I hope they aren’t viewing it as the series is gone.
It is still alive
Theortically, sure. But it would be one helluva miracle. And Cook hasn’t looked or acted like they had a shot at winning this from Day 1 of this series and if your skipper is like that…well…
2-0 down
Sending players home
Having to seriously consider buttler and duckett as test batters
Moeeen ali top six
Broad inj
Woakes inj
No serious spin threat
Capt out of form and under pressure
Opener gone home inj
I’d say it’s series gone so just use it to blood gubbins/Jennings and see what happens